Cascade Crew

QwkTrip · Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 7:21 pm Post subject: Okay, I give up. Where is it?

I need an exploded view of an LS1 engine with every last little bolt, washer, and part shown WITH PART NUMBERS. Anybody run across this before?

I found an exploded view but it just says "Bolt". Ya, duh. I can see that.

iansane · Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 8:35 pm Post subject:

Make friends with a GM counter jockey.

DBL_TKE · Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 6:55 am Post subject:

Even then the sizes aren't always specified.

aaron_sK · Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 8:57 am Post subject:

Perhaps I am missing something here, but why not just take a measurement for length and thread pitch, and buy a replacement bolt? Who cares what GM used from the factory. You think my old Ford stuff runs all the original FoMoCo bolts from 1963? Razz

QwkTrip · Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 11:26 am Post subject:

Not all bolts are equal. I need to have a reference.

If you didn't drive a Ford then the bolts wouldn't be falling out and missing in the first place.

91RSVert · Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 12:16 pm Post subject:

aaron_sK · Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 2:45 pm Post subject:

Twilightoptics · Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 3:41 pm Post subject:

Only things like mains, rods, oil pump, heads, etc are important. Any external bolt can be just able anything.

QwkTrip · Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 3:43 pm Post subject:

I might have to do that. Still would like to see if I can find a full parts list.

QwkTrip · Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 3:49 pm Post subject:

Aha! Provided by a guy at LS1tech.com

http://www.compnine.com/index.php?s=...321&makecode=P

Much easier.

aaron_sK · Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 3:50 pm Post subject:

Twilightoptics · Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 4:48 pm Post subject:

chevymad · Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 5:00 pm Post subject:

I think nearly every bolt in an LS style motor is torque to yield. They may all need to be replaced.. and with the proper bolts.

QwkTrip · Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 5:31 pm Post subject:

iansane · Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 9:07 pm Post subject:

aaron_sK · Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 9:11 pm Post subject:

QwkTrip · Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2011 6:12 am Post subject:

aaron_sK · Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2011 7:35 am Post subject:

More clamping force with a cheaper bolt.

You're an engineer Jon. You know the "design and function" thing is a line for the salesmen. These "problems" are caused by bean counters far more than they are caused by actual physical issues.

Obviously the fact is that I can order reusable rocker bolts from Comp Cams shows that it's not an issue of tensile strength needed, it's the fact that Comp charges $20 for a set of 12, and GM Parts Direct charges $3.75 for the same set in factory TTY. ARP wants $80 for a head stud kit, GM wants $30 for TTY head bolts.

It was a decision made by GM engineers who figured that the number of times that the parts held down by TTY fasteners would need to be replaced under warranty (and thus require GM to pay for new fasteners) would be more than offset by a reduction in manufacturing costs. So 100K miles down the road when you or I get the car we have to muck around with this stupid BS while GM sits on a pile of cash.

Now go look an on old 80's Oldsmobile with one of those god-forsaken GM diesels in it and you'll see an engine where the TTY bolts are absolutely a necessity due to the low number of head bolts used in a high-pressure application.

QwkTrip · Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:23 am Post subject:

You have a dark and jaded view of engineering. You have an absolutely correct view of aftermarket parts sales. Laughing

In my experience most problems are the result of poor design or manufacturing quality. Cost is a constraint that can be challenging. I've had a manager say I can't use an awesome product because of cost. I've never had a manager say I have to use a crummy product. A good engineer has to be much more than a technical expert. They have to know how to sell an idea and make a convincing story that is meaningful to a manager. Many engineers have such a wide role of responsibilities that they are like a micro-business within the company. In my case I am responsible for approximately $120,000,000 per year.

I've never met this person who is referred to as the "Bean Counter." Engineering managers make all the decisions while keeping in mind profitability. At the end of the day it is a business -- and I want a pay check too.

blue89 · Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2011 12:57 pm Post subject:

I would tend to agree with you but there is the problem of having a sales driven engineering manager. I've been told to use crappy product before when I knew there was something better. Boss said I had to, so I did. For the most part though, the boss will do whatever I say is the best decision, so that's nice.