Cascade Crew

blue89 · Posted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 11:43 am Post subject: Autocross Setup

Does anyone autocross their V6 camaro? I'm looking for solid advice for suspension setups. I'm having troubles making the front hook. I have two sets of springs and swaybars for the front and rear.

Current setup

Front
32mm sway
IROC front springs cut down
1.5* camber
4* castor
0" toe

Rear
21mm sway
stock springs cut down

Eurathane everything, LCA's, Panhard, and a-arms are boxed. Car was lowered enough that the A-arms and panhard are almost dead parallel with the ground. I'm going to try to setup 1/8-1/16" of toe out, and hopefully SFC's with a strut tower brace before the next event to help. Any help would be awesome!

Dewey316 · Posted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 11:56 am Post subject:

Our cars always have problems getting the front end to bite.

I assume you are using a pyrometer or shoepolist to adjust tire pressure during the events.

Other than that, You might try softening the front. Running the IROC springs front/rear on a V6 car is likely part of the issue. You might need to step up to a 24mm rear sway bar. Either way, you need to either soften the front end, or stiffen up the rear-end.

the toe-out, will help with initial tun in at auto-x speed. but it won't help corner exit understeer.

You can also try to adjust your driving style a little. braking late, and trail braking into the corner will help the front end bit into the corner better.

blue89 · Posted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 1:09 pm Post subject:

I run 40psi in the front tires, 38 in the rear left, 35 in the rear right. Helps with traction. I have traction problems with my V6. Sweet. But I am checking temps by hand at the event. This combo seems to be close to the best.

Just to screw off and learn about sway bars, I was going to take the bars out all together and put them back in, starting with the smallest size. But i intend to drive the car without them for sure!

The car runs faster when I brake late and hard. I tried to trail brake but that just makes it understeer worse. I think the front is just too stiff. The car has no squat, and very little dive as it is. I'd hate to put the V6 springs back in. I'll start with the sway bars. Last time I checked, the car was 3100 lbs, 1650 front, 1450 rear (full tank). I'll check it again and post.

QwkTrip · Posted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 4:30 pm Post subject:

The only time I autocrossed my V6 I ended up blowing both rear axle seals, smoked the clutch, and soaked the rear brakes with brake fluid. I was young and stupid. But it was a fun day! Very Happy

Dewey316 · Posted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 4:35 pm Post subject:

Thats what we like to hear!

You know the cascadecrew moto.

"Drive it like you stole it!"

QwkTrip · Posted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 6:51 pm Post subject:

If you never beat on your car then you never had fun with it. If you race you will become a good mechanic by default. Autocross is very destructive to the vehicle.

iansane · Posted: Mon Jul 10, 2006 11:59 pm Post subject:

Quasi-Traction · Posted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 12:15 am Post subject:

or "what would dewey do"

blue89 · Posted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 7:52 am Post subject:

Found a VERY helpful site.

www.frrax.com

Fbody Road Race and Autocross forum.

Dewey316 · Posted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 7:58 am Post subject:

Yeah, I have been a member at ffrax for a long time. Its a great site, with some really smart people.

blue89 · Posted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 8:36 am Post subject:

whats the most extreme modification to the suspension you've ever heard of? Like a-arm relocation or custom crossmembers.

Dewey316 · Posted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 8:52 am Post subject:

I don't get what you are asking. I have hung out with Karl Hunter, and saw their Super Production 73 vette, that was a full tube-frame, custom built car.

blue89 · Posted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 9:28 am Post subject:

oh, i ment things that you have to do to the stock chassis. Like Panhard rod relocation brackets and stuff. I saw a Nissan 350Z with Hiem joint looking king pin brackets. They took the stock lower a-arm and welded a nut on the end so they could mount a hiem joint. Crazy.

Dewey316 · Posted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 9:35 am Post subject:

You don't see a lot of really crazy stuff, the stock chassis is pretty good. the PHB relocation is one of the few suspension points that gets moved on our cars, really, the LCA's and PHB are the only ones that need any movement of the mounting points.

I think it wouuld be really neat to do a watts link, but the packaging would be crazy, and the added weight is probably not worth it on our cars, considering the length of the PHB and the minimal suspension movement.

blue89 · Posted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 10:05 am Post subject:

The rear of my car is lowered a bit, but not too much. maybe 2" until the bump stops. But my panhard bar is almost flat. The panhard relocation is to make it more flat, but how low do people make the rear of these cars? I don't see a need to relocate it cause it seems perfect how it is. Unless the goal is to give the PHB a slight angle for when the rear lifts?

blue89 · Posted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 10:36 am Post subject:

its amazing what you will do next when you've done all you can and it still isn't enough. I'm thinking about redrilling holes for the a-arms to change my roll center, relocating my radiator further back and moving the battery from the rear to behind the passenger seat to change the polar moment. I never once thought I'd be doing the things I'm doing before I started racing....

blue89 · Posted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 10:39 am Post subject:

blue89 · Posted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 10:55 am Post subject:

oh, ya, thats my car on autocross day. You can almost see my sidepipe exhaust....

Dewey316 · Posted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 11:04 am Post subject:

That looks like a nice area for a course.

I should get myself out there, and run with you one of these days.

(although, I am not a fan of shagging cones, so I haven't been auto-x'ing in a while. Would be fun if a couple of us portland guys came out there for a day to run with you though.)

blue89 · Posted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 12:50 pm Post subject:

The lot isn't bad. its a bit dirty, but we just end up sweeping the tight corners with brooms to help. So far, I've never autocrossed with another camaro Crying or Very sad

The next event is on Sept 27 in Everette if you guys feel like coming up! Before then, I hope to have a lot more done to the car.

I'll keep this thread posted with improvements I discover and try.