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Something odd

 
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chevymad
Master B


Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 5472


1987 Pontiac Formula

PostPosted: Thu Apr 25, 2019 6:51 pm    Post subject: Something odd Reply with quote

Definitely doing things different. Been sort of disappointed since putting on the E heads and bigger camshaft. No matter how much I reworked the Qjet idle circuit it was never stable, and the whole thing just seemed lazy.

I've gone computerless before, and while it works, I've never liked the TCC solutions available. I've tried the early gm way with vacuum switch and brake release etc.. I also have a B&M TCC controller. Didn't like either of em. The CCC system with ZZ4 chip works just like I like it, so I've stayed with the whole outdated ECM setup.

Then the other day I noticed that you can now buy a nice TPS setup for a holley style carb. This will allow me to keep the factory ecm controlling both the TCC and give me a programmable/load sensing timing curve with knock retard. I just need to program the chip to ignore mixture control(which it only did at cruise anyway).

I started looking for a mid sized holley. Holy crap when did used junk get so expensive?? I didn't want a 600, nor a 750 if I could help it. Searched the entire PIR swap meet and found nothing I wanted. Craigs and Ebay want $150-200 for a used 670 avenger. So I ended up going with a QuickFuel Brawler. It's a 4150 style carb, 670cfm, 4 corner idle, electric choke, adjustable secondaries, screw in air bleeds, and big plus about $100 cheaper then a new holley. Yet built by holley?? When I opened the box, I thought I got a return because it smelled like gas. Then I read in the instructions that every carb is run on an engine before being boxed and shipped. Amazing for that price.

Been alot of small crap to buy to get her hooked up. But fired her off tonight. Started right up and idled cold.. the Qjet wouldn't do that. Warmed her up and tried adjusting the mixture screws. Waste of time, they were set up perfectly out of the box! I just had to lower the idle a smidgen.

I haven't burned a new chip yet(gotta suprise coming there I hope) So the light's on at the moment. And I'm still waiting for an air cleaner that fits, but I took her for a trial run. Meant to go easy to make sure the TV cable was set right. Instead I left some black marks at the end of the drive. Turned around at the Y and come back. Smile Smile Then I let off and just happened to suck a stray dirt particle into the primary needle. Sad Flooded out badly at the end of the drive. But managed to clear her out and get it back in the barn.

So far I think I did good. We will see how this whole experiment goes anyway.
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chevymad
Master B


Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 5472


1987 Pontiac Formula

PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2019 12:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some pics. Needing some serious cleanup/polishing under the hood.
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Schultzy89GTA
M.R.A. (11sec Club)


Joined: 08 Jan 2004
Posts: 4412
Location: Dumbasscus

1989 Pontiac GTA

PostPosted: Fri May 03, 2019 9:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cool. We should do a few cruises this summer.

-Schultzy
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chevymad
Master B


Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 5472


1987 Pontiac Formula

PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2019 7:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Finally got a chip to work. Using Tunerpro I started with the ZZ4 chip chevy sold. Been using that for awhile. .Then I turned off the flags for rich/lean and the 2 mixture solenoid codes. This worked for one code but was still setting C23. Not sure why that happens. Was also setting Prom error 51 but finally got that straightened out.

Code 23 is the ecm not seeing return voltage from the mix solenoid. So I figured I'd put a resistor in to fool it. Solenoid measures 24ohms, so I took 2 50ohm resistors and put them in parallel.. no more code!! Car running fine. Except the resistors got freaking HOT. Debated just hooking up an old solenoid but I don't want that hanging around. So I figured I'd lower the current and see if the return voltage was enough to keep the ecm happy. Grabbed the first large ohm resistor out of my bag (38k ohm) and wired it in. Still no code, ecm is happy and I can't even tell if the resstor is warm so 38k it is.

Kinda funny watching the scanner go closed loop with no mixture control at all! lol

The holley tps sensor is working fine, had a bit of an issue with making it fit the quickfuel carb. Had to shorten the bracket legs an 1/8" . Odd
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chevymad
Master B


Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 5472


1987 Pontiac Formula

PostPosted: Sun May 19, 2019 5:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Resistor seems to be working. No SES light popping up or anything. I'm thinking now I should be able to add wideband support(not functional) for tuning. I'll have to identify a 5v sensor I'm no longer using. Maybe barometer? Use that as an input.

Also borrowed the old OTC scanner from work. Looks like I should be able to hook that to my laptop and use it as a datalogging cable. I've never been able to get a cable that works right with the CCC system. I will still have to get into the hex code and write out a section of the chip that changes timing when datalogging. I've found a source on a monte forum, but got a checksum error when I used it.

The chips I'm using aren't actually the right ones for my programmer. I've got 2532JL's instead of 2532A JL. Programming voltage is 25v for the JL"S and 21v for the A version. Programmer supports only 21v. So I'm lucky to have been able to get any working chips burned. I do have a supply of the A version coming from China. I think they just landed in CA.
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chevymad
Master B


Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 5472


1987 Pontiac Formula

PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The OTC scanner to PC hookup was a bust. They made software for it, but all I had was a demo. They want far too much on ebay for the software.

Still rough at cold start.. odd since both carb's do it. Once warmed up it runs fine.

I've had to remove the BowTie Overdrives TV kit from the trans and carb. Used a Fast bracket setup, and swapped the TV spring back to a stocker. The tv kit cam that mounts to the carb won't fit on the newer holley linkage. Without it their spring is much too stiff. Give you a leg cramp trying to push the throttle. Also so stiff that it tries to pull the adjustment of the tv cable. Sucks because that was all set up great before.

My exhaust is finally shot. So i'm making some changes. Ordered a set of chinese stainless long tubes with Y pipe. For the price they look pretty decent. Slightly disappointed though because the ad calls them "Tri-Y" headers.. nope, just standard 4 into 1 long tubes. I'll bet "Tri-Y" is like a brand name or something.

The Hooker's bout rusted through too, so I'm switching to Magnaflow on the rest of the exhaust.

Surprisingly my old Hedman shorties aren't really that bad, just the Y pipe shot again. So if anyone needs a set let me know.
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chevymad
Master B


Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 5472


1987 Pontiac Formula

PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh and I've allready got the drivers side header in. Getting the hedman shorty out was actually more of a pain then dropping the long tube back in. Valve cover and oil filter had to come off though. I'm also in need of shorty plugs for these. #1 is too close to the header tube. Only interference so far is one tube of the header just touches a corner of the a-arm mount. I'll give that a trim later.

These are the headers.. sold by several sellers.. https://www.ebay.com/itm/FOR-82-92-CAMARO-FIRBIRD-V8-SBC-AUTOMATIC-AT-LONG-TUBE-TRI-Y-EXHAUST-HEADER-KIT/202570801500?_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20160908105057%26meid%3D0f805ec71e704c41b25bd890be22569c%26pid%3D100675%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D15%26mehot%3Dpp%26sd%3D202570801500%26itm%3D202570801500&_trksid=p2481888.c100675.m4236&_trkparms=pageci%3A3b861908-a2cd-11e9-8190-74dbd18036d2%7Cparentrq%3Ada315b4e16b0a4e8e073c319ff7eda8f%7Ciid%3A1
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