Cascade Crew

[Dewey316]

Ok, so Brandon and Mike have already heard this discussion, but here is the deal, I am looking for input. I am got the 4x4 itch, and am trying to descide what route to go with, after I get the Audi running.

Here is what I am looking for, something that I can pick up for under $5k, put a bit of work into, and go hit the trails. I want a solid front axle, and the ability to stick at least 33's on it, without going to really exotic parts.

Before everyone say's wrangler. I thought about that, but I think I want a little more room than that, since I am a skiier, I want to be able to toss the ski's in the back, and be warm on the ride up the mountain. So what I am thinking about, is a bit bigger of a SUV.

I've come up with 3 diffrent options, that stick out.

Early 4Runners, Cherokee's and Land-Rovers. They all have good and bad about them, so discuss away on what route you would go, and if any other ideas come to mind. Right now, I am leaning on the land-rover route, as I can get a 94-98 Discovery for pretty cheap, and there is a lot of aftermarket support, and they are easier to find than the Yota. But I really am just researching, and looking at options.

--John

[zer0321]

My vote is for the XJ Cherokees...you can find one with the 4.0L I6 for dirt cheap, and they are practically bullet proof, and can be built up pretty capable for uber cheap! there are so many on and off the road that parts are a dime a dozen. When AMC designed them way back when, there was no "planned longetivity" in mind.

I've owned a few with almost 300k miles on the original engine and they ran great when I sold them. The downside is they aren't exactly the most refined ride on the road though, and gas mileage isn't exactly the greatest for it's size. I typically will get about 18-20mpg on mine...

I also own a TJ Wrangler in addition to my Cherokee...I love it, but it's just not as practical for everyday life.

For $5k you could have one hell of a capable XJ- and it's a Jeep!

[Demon]

http://houston.craigslist.org/car/399003349.html


built like a brick shithouse on wheels




http://seattle.craigslist.org/oly/car/400507282.html
this is a damn steal in my opinion, you can use it for parts, or fix the transmission... the axles work really well on oh... I dunno... a K5 blazer conversion

here's one at fort lewis... 4 day auction time
http://cgi.govliquidation.com/auction/view?id=1331786&convertTo=USD



just something to think about...

[blue89]

I second the Cherokee. The one we had was unstoppable! 94 Cherokee Sport 4x4 4.0L. Plus there are a million of them around.

[Sellmanb]

http://images.cardomain.com/member_images/10/web/370000-370999/370008_181_full.jpg

there's my vote

[kenf729]

Ok, maybe of topic a bit but I was thinking the same thing...I need a 4X4, so I picked up a 77 1/2 ton K10 pickup, good running 350, th350 tranny fulll time 4 wheel dirve, new bed and an extra cab, wiring harnes plus many extras...

Won't a truck like this suit your needs? I mean I picked it up for $500 bucks...a little work and paint it should be good as..well almost...new...

Ken

[blue89]

Get one like me and you can use it as a tent as well as tow any car you need to!

[Dewey316]

[blue89]

Nuh uh, Tahoe is an SUV and I'm at 117.5".

[Dewey316]

thus why the tahoe is not listed in my short list of solid front axle, short wheel base SUV's.

[Dewey316]

Adam,

Looking at the XJ's, it seems that a 4.5" lift or so is needed to fit 31's, more so to go any bigger, even with the high pinion years (up to 94 ?????), I would imagine that I would be dealing with some vibration issues, and needed new driveshafts.

What type of modifications were done to your XJ?

--John

[QwkTrip]

I have a 2000 Jeep Cherokee with a 3" Old Man Emu lift. The largest tires a Cherokee can handle is 31" without cutting fenders. It doesn't really matter what lift you have. You still have to cut fenders. Once you get the larger tires you have to think about where you'll store the full size spare. A rear bumper with tire carrier will push $1000+.

The Cherokee is small which is good for the trail, and public parking lots as well. But the rear axle is a weak Dana 35. Running over 32" tires will result in axle failure. If you lock the rear you will have to be careful with your throttle using any tires. Some older Cherokees come with the Chrysler corprate rear end, and a few came with Dana 44 somewhere near '88 and '89. Early Ford Explorer Ford 8.8 rearends can be swapped in with just a little work. It's a nice upgrade that will get you disc brakes in the process.

The factory brakes suck. Period. They can hardly stop the vehicle let alone with any load or small trailer. Mine had a ton of front dive when braking. This was fixed by installing the Old Man Emu system. There are two transfer cases. One is the NP231 with part-time 4WD. That's the one you want. The other is the NP241(?) with part-time and full-time 4WD. It's a neat feature for icy roads, but doesn't have the strength for off-road about.

I have to tell you that it's quirky and has terrible manners on ice. You will be using 4WD in conditions that other people might still use 2WD. It has the best heater/defrost I have ever seen and warms up quick! The A/C is awesome. And there's never been any concern of overheating. It can lunge off the line but doesn't seem to get any faster. Peterson's Off Road once described it as the only engine that got slower as it revved up. Mileage is like a full size truck. Don't expect to save anything on gas.

You can find all kinds of info at jeepforum.com

[QwkTrip]

[Dewey316]

Jon,

I'm looking for a trail rig, that is why I am wanting something cheap(ish). This is the plus and minus game. The LR can go 33's with a 3" lift, and has V8 power, but its a bloody british built car, which sucks. The jeep, will ride horribly, and is ugly as sin, but parts are everywhere, problem is, from what I have seen, the guys going 33" end up with a 5"-6" lift, and trimming and upgrading axles, and this and that. The toyotas are cool, but hard to find with the 22re and a solid front axle. I am just getting input from other people, because those are the 3 options I see, I am sort of hoping someone will come up with another option too.

--John

[Twilightoptics]

You're kinda of screwed because of what you want and when they went IFS. Your best bet would be to roll a newer Yota. You can crank the torsion bars and fit 35"s. I've seen it done. Problem is, there is virtually no suspension travel.

Don't know anything about the Rovers, and I've never seen one on the trails.

Second bet would be the Cherokee. But you need the lift to do so. Lifts are that expensive for it because it's not 4 corner coils. The back is Leaf and the front is coils IIRC.

I still think the wrangler is the best way to go. I'm warm. 2" coil spring spacers, 1" body lift, 33's. Bam. You could always do the rack like Luke. I don't know how long ski's are really, but you could probably fit them in the back at an angle. Just only have room for two people.

[Dewey316]

Paul,

That space is one of the main reasons that i haven't looked at wranglers, well that and the price, they are bloody expensive. I want something that I am not afraid to hurt. The problem with the wrangler, is you are hard pressed to toss a cooler, a tent, some gear, and 3 friends to head out of town for the weekend. I can very much appreciate that it is probably the most capable rig out there (short of H1's), but I *think* at this point, I want something with more room.

I really like the 90-96 4runners, but IFS, and a high strung V6. I really looked at them, and looked at what was involved with a SA swap on them, I just don't like that route all that much. I dunno, maybe I would be ok with an IFS setup. I am not looking to build a rock buggy, but I want something that I can go do stuff with, be it camping, or wheeling, or skiing.

(PS, you haven't seen a rover on the trails, because you haven't gone out of the US. I was amazed at the crap a STOCK rover was chewing through in Africa.)

[chevymad]

I think the cherokee is going to be your cheapest route myself. They'll go pretty much anywhere. .Get one new enough to at least not have the renault/bendix electronics. Personally I'd just hack the fenders and apply flairs to get the tires on. It's allready ugly. Rear leaf's are cheap to lift with blocks, not the best way but millions have done it. Or put a body lift on. Again pretty cheap. If you ever go to farm country you'll see alot of farmers using cherokee's for their irrigation rig. They play in the mud all day with basically stock tires. If its a trail rig, it wont look pretty very long anyway. As somebody said above, I've seen many with over 300k on the clock still running. They usually blow lots of oil into the air cleaner but continue to run forever.

[iansane]

Another vote for the Cherokee.

A 3-4" and you can run 32s and wheel most stuff. My buddy has one that originally had 2.8 and now runs a TPI 350. Hauls ass too. Coil sprung front and it'd be EASY to slap a long arm setup and subframe connectors to get some articulation out of it.

[zer0321]

[Xophertony]

i don't know john... the way you were talking the other day sounded like you were prety set on a land rover... additionaly there is the "unique" factor of having a safari built rover in the states.

that being said.. a SFA swap is NOT that hard, you just need to do a little engineering math (you seem to know your way around that stuff) and be able to weld. my brother can knock one out in under a week. in fact i think he and a friend did a SFA swap on a 90 4runner in a weekend.