Cascade Crew

[scott in wa.]

Hello everyone.
My son wanted a z28 and we found a 87 near Portland, so we towed it home and are in the process of putting a .060 over 350 in it.
We still have the 305
It’s an auto
I was wondering when we get around to getting a chip burned, is there some one here that can do it?
This has been a good experience for my son, he is 17 and I had talked with him about your club. He was very interested. So we should be attending some of your get together.
Is there a member ship fee? Or something? How does that work?

I posted this on third generation under tpi and found out about this group

http://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/showthread.php?s=5c782de98c06d33afec8478fea4f2b4e&threadid=313732

Many thanks
Scott, and Chris

[iansane]

Hey, It's nice too see more enthusiastic thirdgenners around here. There are a few more in the Tacoma area, quite a few north and south of here as well.

I don't know much about custom tuning. I just started messing with my bird as well. Do you have anything to burn your own chips? We should have a small mini-gathering with some other local tacoma guys.

No membership fee (that I know of!). Moreso just a bunch of guys that like to talk about crap and our cars.

Most of the Portland area guys are more active on this board though.

[scott in wa.]

No I don't have anything to burn chips.
But I may have to buy the stuff to do it.
My son is really into his car, even though it is just sitting in the drive.
He is always messing with something
No motor in it...hehehe
Soon there will be.
Thanks
Scott

[Dewey316]

[iansane]

[scott in wa.]

wow that sounds interesting
pros and cons on this?
how about cost wise?
thanks
scott

[iansane]

I'm not too familiar on price of chip burning and such. I'm sure john (dewey) can help with that.
I payed $175 for my prominator. I borrow a laptop and aside from the $30 "donation" for the Tunerpro software that was it, I think. Oh yeah and an ALDL cable (which I bought ) but you can make for REAL cheap.

Have you checked out the DIY-PROM board at thirdgen.org? You can learn SO much there. I've learned a lot but I'm more of a learn-as-I-do/learn-as-I-watch kind of guy.

[Dewey316]

[chevymad]

Glad to see you made it over here Scott. I see some of the tuner guys are allready helping you out. That's an area I know little about. Old fashioned carb guy here. Not sure when our next gathering will be but that's definately a great time to have these guys help you. Much easier hands on. I read that DIY prom board and don't have a clue myself.

[scott in wa.]

Thanks
guys we will be looking forward to getting together at some point. I just hpe the kids car is running then.
Its taken a while to get to this point.

so what do you guys think about the cam and the heads we are using?
lt4 hot cam, 305 heads ported with bigger vales 52cc
roller rockers
pistons are silvolite .060 over 70 cc dish.
stock tpi stuff from the 305.

is 28lb injectors to big???
I have been looking at them on e-bay.

thanks
scott

[Dewey316]

28 might be a little large. 22 or 24 would probably be about right.

The hotcam in a 305 might be a little much for TPI, tpi really optomizes itself around 3850rpm, and tends to fall off about 4500rpm. Something in the range of 206*-212* intake duration at .050" is a pretty good match for TPI, the 90-92 G92 305's (the ones that made the most power) came stock with a L98 cam (IIRC, its about 202* intake). You don't really want to go much bigger with TPI.

[scott in wa.]

4800, hummm
I was not going to exceed 6,500 maybe 7,000
and the kid wanted a realy nasty lop to the idal.
So I said here ya go... but your gass milage will be nasty.

Although we could go with a big mouth set up, but Iam not sure I want to do that yet. Could always put it on later. It will be interesting to see how the heads work out as well.

So I guess we will see what happens ,
Right now I just need it running. Ive got two months I and would like to see him driving it by then .

thanks
scott

[Dewey316]

Scott, most of the computer controlled cars, don't get the rumpity idle, just like the hot cam, the LSA is wide enough, that you don't get that nasty overlap that gives it the idle. Really the solution to give it some good top end, is to ditch the TPI in favor of something like Holley Stealth-Ram, or a TPIs Miniram. Even if you go with a big port TPI setup, it has a fatal flaw, that is the runner length. The harmonic resonance tuning that gives TPI its name, uses the runner length to tune powerband for the 3500-4500 rpm range, but that tuning starts to work against itself above that range, cuasing a very in-efficiant intake system for upper RPM breathing. The hot cam, with a HSR and some good heads, could be a pretty brutall combo on a 305, it would really rip in the upper RPMs. It just isn't going to do that with TPI.

Although, tuning we can help with.

[scott in wa.]

Well , I have been reading lots on the cams but they didn't make it sound so bad.
I do rember a few people that liked the hot cam.
But its not to late to chage, yet. We still could change the cam.
Iam useing a 350 short block .060 over, the 305 heads have been worked over realy good ported and polished bigger stainless valves, high lift springs and all that stuff.

But I think he wants to stay with the tpi set up.
So now I don't know if Iam going to go with that cam or not.

I would like to get 300 hp to the rear wheels, or just under that.
whats your suggestion, with keeping the heads I have and useing the tpi I have.
I calculated the heads and dished piston to be right at 10-1

thanks
scott

[Dewey316]

Ahh, I didn't realise this was on a 350, I for some reason thought it was a 305.

That hot cam is not huge for a 350, probably not "ideal" for TPI, but not so bad.

THIS CAM orTHIS CAM would be a pretty good choice, it should be a solid performer, and is a hair smaller on the duration that the hotcam. But has a good ammount of lift.

[scott in wa.]

That’s ok..
It’s a 350 short block with the reworked 305 heads.
I decided not to stick the 305 back in.
Maybe I will put it in my Old K5 blazer (its about had it)
I found a Washington state patrol car short block that had about 30,000 on it.
It had a broken ring.
That’s why I had to go .060 over.
That’s where it all started.
Originally I was going all stock on the 305 then at some point things got complicated, and BAM......I have a 350.....Kid must have been whispering in my ear.

What do you think about the horse power???
Thanks
Scott

[Dewey316]

300 to the wheels is a pretty tall order for TPI, 300hp crank should be doable though, with a good cam, TPI really doesn't do high in the HP numbers, because it was designed to make low-mid range torque, you will see some big torque numbers from TPI with the right cam and heads.

[scott in wa.]

Ya I thought it may take some doing.
I didn't want that peanut cam in 350, that was in the 305.

So do you still think 26lb injectors ar to big??
I have been looking at some on e-bay but not quite sure what style will work for us.
thanks
scott

[scott in wa.]

Thought Id keep ya up to date on this.

This Sat. we put the short block together. Everything looks good, went together smooth. Except the engine builder pressed one of the pistons on 180 off, had to take them back down and have it turned around. Man that doesn't make me feel to good as I had them bore the block, but everything else checked out.
ordered stainless roller rockers today 3/8 by 1.5 when they get here we will put the re-worked heads on.
I want to have it in and running in 4 weeks.
Heck who knows, we might make it.
thanks
scott and son

[CheezX]

I know I didn't really prove this on the dyno but I believe 300hp at the wheels on a 350 is very achievable with a long tube TPI setup. It will need an aftermarket base and runners (preferably AS&M/TPIS runners, not a casting). They're a little bit shorter and will bump the RPM range up a bit, and flow isn't a problem. Good heads, well matched cam, and exhaust. All the usual stuff.

I know mine died after 4400 rpm but that wasn't because of the intake. I fixed the problems (no more broken stuff or black/blue smoke) and ended up with a 17% increase in the VE tables above 4k rpm. Peak power is now between 5200-5600 rpm and that would be a rough estimate of 380-400rwhp. This isn't backed up by track times or dyno numbers but the old VE curve matched the dyno numbers closely and the new numbers are close to Desktop Dyno numbers (yeah I know ) so I'd call it a good estimate.

Actually take the old numbers 340rwhp x 350ci/400ci and you get 300rwhp. And you'd have to do it at 4400rpm x 400/350 = 5000rpm. Its in the range with room to spare. Match it all up and you're good to go. The only problem is you probably wouldn't get that lopey idle your son is looking for, instead it would get stock gas milage and drive well at low speed.