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Fan Wiring
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fiveoformula
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Joined: 08 Aug 2007
Posts: 1799
Location: OR

1988 Pontiac Formula

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 2:25 pm    Post subject: Fan Wiring Reply with quote

So.. When I was 16 and my single fan quit, natually the best idea at the time was to cut up wiring and put it on a toggle switch.
But now im tired of dealing with turning it on/off and it isn't that reliable, seems im always fixing it, SO im looking to put the wiring back to factory, with solder and heat shrink and get a lower temp stock style thread-in fan switch.
Any suggestions on a temp switch that will turn on around 185*-200*?
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fiveoformula
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Joined: 08 Aug 2007
Posts: 1799
Location: OR

1988 Pontiac Formula

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 3:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Considering this jet switch only because it comes with a new connector and the temp seems about what im looking for.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/jet-60600/overview/year/1988/make/pontiac/model/firebird
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chevymad
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Joined: 11 Jan 2004
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1987 Pontiac Formula

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 4:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Go with an aftermarket switch. I went through I don't know how many stock and stock type but lower temp switches before I gave up on them. Forget who's switch I'm using now but it works and is still working like a year later. More then I can say for the others.

Also I'd move the switch out of the head, especially if you have headers. Mine was always melting down. So I installed it in my thermostat housing.
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aaron_sK
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Joined: 23 Jan 2006
Posts: 8834
Location: Back in beautiful Tacompton

1987 Chevrolet Camaro IROC-Z

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some thoughts:

Don't use GMs factory fan relay. It is hot garbage. Use a Bosch 4 or 5-pin relay with a wireable plug that can be mounted somewhere. Cheaper and more reliable than GM.

Summit used to carry their own brand of fan switches in the $25 range, but that was years ago.

Be careful not to get a switch with a knock sensor-style connector. That's what took out Al's engine on the dyno.

The price on that Jet switch stings a bit, but it looks like a nice product.

I disagree with the idea of removing it from the head. You will get the quickest and most accurate temp readings there. Putting it in the intake is not bad per-se, but it will react slower. IMO if your connector wiring is melting due to headers then you have a tune problem, not a sensor location problem. Laughing
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chevymad
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Joined: 11 Jan 2004
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1987 Pontiac Formula

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 5:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You will get the hottest temp in the head. I wouldnt say thats most accurate. Mine's even on the cold side of the thermostat, but doesn't matter since fan temp is higher then thermo temp.

In 304k miles I have yet to replace the fan relay. I can't say that the gm unit is garbage with that kind of history. I have changed the fan motor twice, the wiring connector 3X and I don't know.. a dozen? switches in that time.

Btw, toggle isn't necessary if you have AC either.. Switching to one of the AC modes automatically turns the fan on full time. I've used this several times when the switch has died on me.

Here's why I say move the sensor from the head. Look how close to the tube the sensor is. Of course its also a bit further out because these heads don't have the right size hole and required a bushing too. But with hedman headers the wiring connector almost touches the tube.


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fiveoformula
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1988 Pontiac Formula

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 9:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I thought about moving the switch to the intake manifold, but I'm concerned with the fan turning on too late, I know 220* on the gauge is fine, but id like to run cooler than that. I'm sure there's a 20* difference between the head and the intake manifold.

Last edited by fiveoformula on Wed Aug 13, 2014 9:51 am; edited 1 time in total
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chevymad
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1987 Pontiac Formula

PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 10:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If that was true the stock 220* fan switch would be coming on at 200* on your gauge.
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fiveoformula
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Joined: 08 Aug 2007
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1988 Pontiac Formula

PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 9:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well the gauge sender is in the drivers side head, and when the gauge reads 185* I look on my laptop at what the CTS is reading (in the intake manifold) its usually 160ish*
Maybe its not correct but thats what it reads.

I think the gauge is correct though, since I run a 180* thermostat, cruising down the road with air flow it runs at 180-190.
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Twilightoptics
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Joined: 13 Jan 2004
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1987 Chevrolet Camaro IROC-Z

PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 4:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Depends on the style of headers for heat issues. My hedmans, and the sensor on the drivers side had NO issues.

Running this one in the mazda with no issues and my MR2 fans. Like aaron said, use a common relay. http://www.summitracing.com/parts/der-16731


The stock relays tend to get hot and the wire insulation wicks down. Plus, when it does take a crap, it's harder to find one.



If you didn't have your fan on a relay, and just through a toggle switch.... that's why you were always fixing it.

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fiveoformula
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Joined: 08 Aug 2007
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Location: OR

1988 Pontiac Formula

PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 6:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

At first I didn't use a relay, but I later added one. I've mostly been dealing with loose connections. Not proud of my teenage wiring skills, at this point it would be better if I took it all out and started over.

I went with a hypertech 4026 switch, baxters had it in stock and it turns the fan on at 176* and off at 166*.
I figure if I decide to install it in the intake it will still most likely turn on under 200* and I'll be happy.
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Twilightoptics
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1987 Chevrolet Camaro IROC-Z

PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 6:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The idea is to bring the temp back down to thermostat control. Unless you have a 160 stat, that switch is too cold and the fan will run a lot and you'll just wear the fan out.
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fiveoformula
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1988 Pontiac Formula

PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 6:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do you think there's actually 20* difference between my CTS (in the intake) and my gauge sending unit (in the head)?
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Twilightoptics
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Once the tstat is open theres negledgable difference.
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aaron_sK
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1987 Chevrolet Camaro IROC-Z

PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 9:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IME a temp taken in the intake vs. the head will be a bit cooler (probably due to heatsoak in aluminum vs. iron more than anything) but not 20* difference, jeez! Laughing

Is this a factory gauge? If so it is almost certainly wrong. Chevy had very poor gauges. Not quite as bad as Ford's on/off gauges, but not much better!
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fiveoformula
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1988 Pontiac Formula

PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2014 3:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

FORD temp guage
Cold [_______________ Normal __________________] Hot

Laughing
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chevymad
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Joined: 11 Jan 2004
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1987 Pontiac Formula

PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2014 4:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ford gauges were actually hooked to idiot light pressure/temp senders instead of gauge units. So they read in the middle until they didn't.
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Twilightoptics
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2014 4:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Which Fords? Just worked on Dad's '88 ranger, it clearly rose slowly with warm up. The Escort also rises.
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chevymad
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1987 Pontiac Formula

PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2014 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I mainly ran into it on mid 80s full size. Not all were that way and I have no idea of the rule. Ford had a few people complain that the oil pressure on their new trucks was too low. Guess this was the answer.

I didn't realize it til I had to change the sending unit on one and it had the switch instead of the guage unit.
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chevymad
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1987 Pontiac Formula

PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2014 5:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

First google hit. Not sure why your dad's was different. Other then you never know what the factory might install sometimes.

http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/101540-oil-pressure-gauge-is-really-an-idiot-light.html
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Twilightoptics
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1987 Chevrolet Camaro IROC-Z

PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2014 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ford certainly doesn't like to be consistent. Truck does have a low oil light too!
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